XNA and its runtime libraries

I haven't heard anything on the runtime files that would be needed to fully execute a XNA program, at least, officially. Managed DirectX caused three runtime files before which I think stopped a ton of programs from being released. Little Timmy wanted to show his friend a Pong game that he wrote, but he needed the .NET framework installed, the Managed DirectX files and the DirectX runtime itself. Add each one up and it was roughly an extra 80mb (I'm guessing). Downloading the games from the web was easy, but executing them had requirements like "you have to download this, this and this." I would have skipped to another game. Is this going to be the same issue with XNA? How does the installation process differ?

[721 byte] By [nullsmind] at [2008-2-13]

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# 1

wow you are right, what will people have to download to get it running? And how much HD space on the 360 will it take, I am running out on that thing (maybe I should finish and part with some demos)

aka_Big_Wurm at 2007-8-31 >

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# 2

<sigh/>

On just about every developer forum I have been on I have seen 'complaints' regarding the need to download a RunTime for .NET

I have been writting 3D .NET applications for several years now. My setup compressed is 250MB (with .NET and DirectX), without it is ~ 210MB. That is not a very big difference and as such I package the required Redistributales with my setup.

And if you distribute on CD it is even less of an issue, include the Runtime on the CD.

Lots of programs nowadays also require IE 5.01 or better installed. That is not a trivial download either. Or WindowsXP sp2 if it isn't already installed.

The same issue used to occure with VB5/6 runtimes, and MFC 4.2 and so on. Most languages require a runtime of some sort to be on the end-users machine.

For the 'Creators Club' the users have to have GSE installed anyways. For windows, use one of the setup packages (including the one that comes with Visual Studio) to create a single file setup that includes the Frameworks Redistributable (which I am sure MS will be providing)

cheers,

Paul

phetheratwork at 2007-8-31 >

# 3

My frustration about the runtime is that it does not come as a automatic update or part of a service pack 2. Let’s say you make a quick application in C# or VB it’s a simple application a megabyte or less, if your user has the runtime it’s a quick download and installation. There have been times I waited to install a program because I did not want to download and install the runtime.

aka_Big_Wurm at 2007-8-31 >

# 4

I understand that Microsoft knows about the installation process with Managed DirectX, and I understand that they are interested in making the installation process easier with installing XNA games. I haven't heard any final word, though, which brought up this topic. I guess we'll know soon enough, but something tells me a student won't have a CD to ship off with three runtimes. I'm usually happy with just one runtime, but three new runtimes for an average user is way too much (50 up to 250mb?). I would like to see how Microsoft solved this known problem as seen with MDX. The Z-Man has been suggesting easier installation as well to the XNA team. Easy distribution through the web is very important. If I was an average user having to download three runtimes, I wouldn't do it. If it came in a CD, I would. But I don't believe most of us mail CDs when us average folks/students just want to post it on the web for a usual free download. And just for a wild guess, considering schools are going to teach students XNA & Express products for the home enthusiests, most XNA programmers will be of this group.

nullsmind at 2007-8-31 >

# 5

I agree XNA Framework Redistributal should be one download if at all possible. (Of course it will probably also require Windows Installer 3.0 if the user doesn't already have that

phetheratwork at 2007-8-31 >

# 6

Easier redistribution of XNA Framework games on Windows is definitely on our radar. The exact solution depends on a lot of factors and will not be part of the first release of XNA Game Studio Express. As another thread mentioned, ClickOnce might be interesting and is something we'll investigate but a complete solution will likely need to wait for the Pro edition of XNA Game Studio.

We definitely understand that the utility and value of the Framework for developers targetting Windows is inversely proportional to the ease of deployment.

Paul

PaulBleisch at 2007-8-31 >

# 7

Glad to hear someone at Microsoft recognizes this issue, though based on past events I'm pretty skeptical that any really good solution will emerge for this issue any time soon. C# would be an absolute no-brainer for Windows indie development of all types (not just games) and IMO the #1 reason it isn't far more widely used is because of deployment issues. Given 2 small apps or games that are otherwise similar, one which installs easily and is a 2 megabyte download and one which is difficult to install (possibly requiring reboots) and is 27 or more megabytes, it is pretty clear which a user would choose to download, and with good reason. The .NET team has done a fantastic job of reducing development time and complexity but (so far) all too often it is all-for-naught because the deployment issues are too much of a pain to expect users to deal with if you're doing online/downloadable deployment.

I'll be happy when Vista is widely deployed as this will mitigate the problem to a large degree, but for now it sucks.

gmcbay at 2007-8-31 >

# 8

gmcbay,

Have you looked at the Microsoft Component Installer? If you're willing to accept that your users need to be connected to install, does it solve some of your issues with .NET installation?

PaulBleisch at 2007-8-31 >

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